38 Special, How Low Can You Go?

[arakboss]

Since I am messing around with 38spl loads, I thought this would be a good time to try out some gallery loads.

My goal is to develope a load that would be comfortable to shoot, out of my Rossi 92, without hearing protection (and with no suppressor).

What's the lowest charge weight in 38spl you have used and with what bullet?

Have you tried shortening the 38spl case to allow for lower charges?

I bought some Bear Creek 105gr cast bullets that might work well for severely reduced loads. 380 bullets could also be used. I will be checking for squibs between each firing.

Maybe heavy bullets would allow for a quieter load?

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[arakboss]

These guys have messed around with short cases to allow for really reduced charges.

Trimming 38 special cases

I have just started shooting a S&W627 and on the advise of other shooters I have aquirred several hundred 38 short caes. I find these much easier for reloading and ejection than the 38 special cases. But before I buy more short cases,I have searched the forum and found that a 38 special trimm...

forums.brianenos.com

These are available if I want to buy more brass rather than cut my 38spl brass down.

38 Short Colt Brass - Small Pistol - Brass Cases

 

[arakboss]

Once a round is loaded subsonic what contributes most to it's noise level? Charge size? Diameter of bore? Pressure? Length of barrel? Velocity? Weight of projectile? Type of powder?

 

[Joe13]

Well keep going until it squibs in the barrel and then you have your answer.

All rifles are going to be different.

 

[TTSX]

Once a round is loaded subsonic what contributes most to it's noise level? Charge size? Diameter of bore? Pressure? Length of barrel? Velocity? Weight of projectile? Type of powder?

Definitely the pressure. The bang you hear is the sudden release of tens of thousands of psi. If you had a couple hundred psi, it'd be remarkably quiet.

 

[arakboss]

Definitely the pressure. The bang you hear is the sudden release of tens of thousands of psi. If you had a couple hundred psi, it'd be remarkably quiet.

That would mean I just need to find the lowest pressure combination that will push the bullet out of the barrel.

I wonder what sort of pressure the CCI Quiet 22 round produces? Or the Aguila Colibri 22 round?

 

[Joe13]

Smaller bullet grain so it wouldn't scale

 

[arakboss]

Well keep going until it squibs in the barrel and then you have your answer.

All rifles are going to be different.

Do you think a squib would be more likely to happen in a revolver or a rifle? It seems like a revolver would bleed off some pressure through the gap between cylinder and forcing cone. On the other hand the rifle would most likely have a longer barrel creating more friction to overcome.

 

[thorborg]

I made my own projectiles for my 45 Colt using paraffin wax that work great and reasonably accurate at gallery distances using only the primer as a power source. A good way to practice fast draw without endangering everything in sight.

 

[arakboss]

"The minimum powder charge which safely enables the bullet to reliably exit the 26" rifle barrel every time is 1.2 grains of Bullseye. This is a "silent but deadly" 450 f.p.s. BLOOP load, with an almost silent report, measured at only 70-72dB at 1 meter from the rifle muzzle. This "CB cap on steroids" is accurate to 25 yards."


Source:

Ed's Essays in GOW

If I could make a similar load as Ed's .32 load but in 38spl, I would be super happy.

 

[arakboss]

Here is the plan. I am loading dry lubed .358 125gr bear creek bullets into full length 38spl cases. According to Lyman manual Bullseye seem to produce the lowest pressure loads so I am using that. I am starting at 3 grains and will do one each at .2 grain reduction down to 1.6 or so. I am going to use revolver for initial testing. It will be easier to clear a squib. If all goes well, than I will load up some more and try them in the Rossi carbine.

 

[Joe13]

Do you think a squib would be more likely to happen in a revolver or a rifle? It seems like a revolver would bleed off some pressure through the gap between cylinder and forcing cone. On the other hand the rifle would most likely have a longer barrel creating more friction to overcome.

Hard to tell BUT if I were doing this for a specific firearm then I would use that as the testing platform and not a completely different firearm.

 

[Joe13]

You don't even have to go all the way to getting one stuck - you can reduce it until it is the decibel level you are hoping for and just stay with that load.

 

[dangerranger60]

A while back I was going to have a series of shoulder surgery's done on my strong side that would keep me in a sling for about a year.
This is when I went to using a revolver again. It was the easiest gun to load, fire, and reload, with only one hand. in practice later I realized that I could hold the gun for a reload without hurting the shoulder.
But before the surgery I learned to load and shoot with only the offhand.
I loaded Lee 105 gr cast bullets to about 500 fps. recoil from an airweight J frame is like a 22 mag.
With these I learned to shoot nearly as well left-handed as I did as a righty.
At near 500 fps from a 2" barrel I never had any bullets stick. But I did not try them in a rifle. DR

 

[arakboss]

Done.

 

[arakboss]

A while back I was going to have a series of shoulder surgery's done on my strong side that would keep me in a sling for about a year.
This is when I went to using a revolver again. It was the easiest gun to load, fire, and reload, with only one hand. in practice later I realized that I could hold the gun for a reload without hurting the shoulder.
But before the surgery I learned to load and shoot with only the offhand.
I loaded Lee 105 gr cast bullets to about 500 fps. recoil from an airweight J frame is like a 22 mag.
With these I learned to shoot nearly as well left-handed as I did as a righty.
At near 500 fps from a 2" barrel I never had any bullets stick. But I did not try them in a rifle. DR

Do you remember what powder and charge weight you used. Lyman data for 121gr lead bullet listed a starting charge of Bullseye at 2.8 grains for 690fps and 8600 CUP. If I don't stick a bullet in the barrel, I am guessing I will get below 500fps by the time I get to the 1.6 grain load.

 

[washagonian]

Well keep going until it squibs in the barrel and then you have your answer.

All rifles are going to be different.

Do NOT let a round squib in the barrel. I had a 38 special squib 1/2 way in my 20" Rossi 92. Disassembling and reassembling the action in order to ram-rod the squib from the chamber end is a real pain in the A$$.

On the bright side, I was able to do a deep cleaning.

Still, not a fun time.

 

[red442joe]

Once a round is loaded subsonic what contributes most to it's noise level? Charge size? Diameter of bore? Pressure? Length of barrel? Velocity? Weight of projectile? Type of powder?

Firing, I suspect....

Sorry, couldn't help myself.

Joe

 

[arakboss]

Do NOT let a round squib in the barrel. I had a 38 special squib 1/2 way in my 20" Rossi 92. Disassembling and reassembling the action in order to ram-rod the squib from the chamber end is a real pain in the A$$.

On the bright side, I was able to do a deep cleaning.

Still, not a fun time.

That doesn't sound like fun. Did you try pushing it back towards chamber from muzzle end?

 

[arakboss]

I am going to try these in revolver first and see how it goes.

I read that freezing firearm will allow squib bullet to be removed easier?