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Sorry if this was posted on another thread. New developments. Armorer is asking for a retrial. State failed to disclose "unexplained toolmarks on critical surfaces of the trigger and sear". Her team is saying it's potentially exculpatory for her. Could it also be exculpatory for Baldwin? I still think Baldwin is liable.

 
Sorry if this was posted on another thread. New developments. Armorer is asking for a retrial. State failed to disclose "unexplained toolmarks on critical surfaces of the trigger and sear". Her team is saying it's potentially exculpatory for her. Could it also be exculpatory for Baldwin? I still think Baldwin is liable.

Of course she is. She's in jail.
 
Sorry if this was posted on another thread. New developments. Armorer is asking for a retrial. State failed to disclose "unexplained toolmarks on critical surfaces of the trigger and sear". Her team is saying it's potentially exculpatory for her. Could it also be exculpatory for Baldwin? I still think Baldwin is liable.

Can't say her attorneys aren't earning their money.
How is Baldwin liable? Full disclosure, I loathe Baldwin.
 
Can't say her attorneys aren't earning their money.
How is Baldwin liable? Full disclosure, I loathe Baldwin.
He was the producer of the movie
Specifically he was the top guy in charge of the set, made all the higher level decisions, had ample warning that there were safety issues on set, took specific steps to bury and ignore those issues, kept the problem people in their delegated responsibilities with zero corrective action and even actively participated in the problem behavior and safety violations. Even if it had been someone else who had pulled the trigger that killed someone Baldwin would still bear the majority share of the culpability in the situation. He was the primary cause of the behavior that lead up to the fatality, and bred a workplace culture that was primed to have a fatal accident at some point. It was basically inevitable.

As far as I am concerned it is simply poetic justice that Baldwin himself is the one who pulled the trigger. At least no one else has to live with that kind of guilt.
 
He was the producer of the movie
So should we hold the CEO of Sig liable when there is an AD of a P365XL? What about a charging a Chief of Police when a LEO uses excessive force? Maybe sue the CEO of Ford for making Mustangs that go way faster than the speed limit?

Yep, he was producer of the movie AND he did hire an "armorer" for the set which seems standard for producing movies with those evil guns. I see a few issues, Armorer was hired because she was the daughter of someone. Horseplay was allowed during breaks and the armorer allowed it. Whoever brought live ammo on set should be charged as an accomplice. The DA wants to prove a point.
 
Specifically he was the top guy in charge of the set, made all the higher level decisions, had ample warning that there were safety issues on set, took specific steps to bury and ignore those issues, kept the problem people in their delegated responsibilities with zero corrective action and even actively participated in the problem behavior and safety violations. Even if it had been someone else who had pulled the trigger that killed someone Baldwin would still bear the majority share of the culpability in the situation. He was the primary cause of the behavior that lead up to the fatality, and bred a workplace culture that was primed to have a fatal accident at some point. It was basically inevitable.

As far as I am concerned it is simply poetic justice that Baldwin himself is the one who pulled the trigger. At least no one else has to live with that kind of guilt.
So all top guys of anything should be criminally charged when underlings fail to do their job and someone is killed or injured? We all know why she allowed horseplay on set. Who was she to tell cast members to not be assclowns? She'd be fired. Now in hindsight, that was better than her current position as prisoner.

Again, I am NOT a fan of Alec. He is a giant D bag BUT I also don't get the sentiment that he deserves what he gets because he is a D bag. We either have individual responsibility or we don't. Now I agree, the family of the deceased is gonna sue Baldwin's production company and maybe they should but that seems par for the course in these types of incidents. Criminally charging a guy simply because he was the "top guy" or his personality sucks is what leftists do. We just saw that with Trump.
 
So all top guys of anything should be criminally charged when underlings fail to do their job and someone is killed or injured? We all know why she allowed horseplay on set. Who was she to tell cast members to not be assclowns? She'd be fired. Now in hindsight, that was better than her current position as prisoner.

Again, I am NOT a fan of Alec. He is a giant D bag BUT I also don't get the sentiment that he deserves what he gets because he is a D bag. We either have individual responsibility or we don't. Now I agree, the family of the deceased is gonna sue Baldwin's production company and maybe they should but that seems par for the course in these types of incidents. Criminally charging a guy simply because he was the "top guy" or his personality sucks is what leftists do. We just saw that with Trump.
This has been covered plenty of times already in this very thread. There are plenty of cases where management has been criminally charged for their own negligence in managing working environments that lead to fatalities. Sometimes the workers also bear culpability, sometimes they do not, as their duties, responsibilities, knowledge and training dictate. In this particular case SAG guidelines (which are based off of legal precedent) dictate that actors are not responsible for safety checking equipment, period. Their job is to act, not set up the scene, run the cameras or manage props. There are other people who do all that, and it is those people who are responsible to make sure the set is safe, with the top dog in that pile being the producer. If the actor is told a set or prop is safe they have near absolute indemnity when it comes to the reasonable handling of that prop. And yes, on a movie set that would include pointing a gun (or gun like object) at a person and pulling the trigger. It is up to the armorer on set to make sure that it is impossible for such acts to result in harm to anyone on set.

But in this particular case the chain of negligence clearly points to Baldwin, even above the armorer. There were several other safety violations and accidents on set prior to the fatality. These were actively ignored, and people who had complained about the safety issues on set were either fired or already left on their own. Baldwin had ample warning and opportunity to fix these issues, but instead chose to carry on, and indeed actively took steps to hide the issues from other relevant parties. This demonstrates not just ignorant indifference, but active and willful negligence on his part. That is what garners him the lions share of the culpability. He is at fault for putting people in charge of set safety who he absolutely knew were not qualified for the position. He is at fault for knowing there were glaring issues with set safety that had already resulted in many near misses, all of which he was personally aware of, and then doing everything in his power to make sure nothing changed so that production could keep chugging forwards. He is at fault for fostering a culture of negligence and indifference that lead to a fatality.

This is not just hating on Baldwin, this is looking at the facts of the situation, considering the relevant legal precedent, and coming to the conclusion that Baldwin does indeed hold nearly all of the culpability for the fatality, shared only in part by the armorer he hired who was clearly shown to be incompetent prior to the fatality.
 
So should we hold the CEO of Sig liable when there is an AD of a P365XL? What about a charging a Chief of Police when a LEO uses excessive force? Maybe sue the CEO of Ford for making Mustangs that go way faster than the speed limit?

Yep, he was producer of the movie AND he did hire an "armorer" for the set which seems standard for producing movies with those evil guns. I see a few issues, Armorer was hired because she was the daughter of someone. Horseplay was allowed during breaks and the armorer allowed it. Whoever brought live ammo on set should be charged as an accomplice. The DA wants to prove a point.
His production company was responsible. Yes, his insurance will have to pay. Is Baldwin going to do anytime or even get convicted of crime probably not.
 
Sure but should Alec be criminally charged? Weird no one really wanted to answer the Qs I asked. I will reply to the lucusloc's comment when I get around a keyboard.
Should he be charged? People get charged because the Grand Jury decides to charge them. There is no "should" other than due process. If the grand jury decides to charge him than that is what they decide to do. No one is obligated to answer your questions . This isnt a job intervierw.
 
Sure but should Alec be criminally charged? Weird no one really wanted to answer the Qs I asked. I will reply to the lucusloc's comment when I get around a keyboard.
Maybe because it's been asked and answered ad nauseam? Some people believe he should, usually pointing to Jeff Cooper's Rules of Gun Safety, others say maybe, but unlikely pointing out SAGA workplace rules that actors are required to follow.
I don't think anybody on here has said no he shouldn't be charged either in one way or the other, but some folks have taken observations that he's unlikely to be charged as the actor and more likely to be charged as a producer is saying that he shouldn't be charged at all
I tend to remember more than one thread on this getting locked down because civility got lost along the way
 
Should he be charged? People get charged because the Grand Jury decides to charge them. There is no "should" other than due process. If the grand jury decides to charge him than that is what they decide to do. No one is obligated to answer your questions . This isnt a job intervierw.

There is always a "should". Moral questions are not valid or invalid based on whether you like them or not.
 
There is always a "should". Moral questions are not valid or invalid based on whether you like them or not.
Thats not a moral question. Its a question of law and due process. Is there enough evidence in a capital case to bring a case to trial.? If yes, the Grand Jury puts it on the docket. Its not a question of morality.

Do I think he should be charged? Who cares what I think? Im not on a Grand Jury.
 
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